If y’all are going to post an incessant drumbeat of why Biden sucks, I’m just gonna keep pasting a few of the reasons why he doesn’t. It’s not just that it’s not his fault that the Republicans kept him from doing good things (although they did prevent him doing much more than that); even hampered by their obstruction, he still managed to among other things:
He took the biggest action on climate change in US history; the goal of the climate bill is to put us on track for a 40% reduction in US emissions by 2030. It’s way too late but that’s clearly not Biden’s fault since he started fighting for it basically as soon as he got into office, and managed to achieve passed legislation which is several standard deviations above the norm for “let’s ignore it until we’re underwater and on fire” US politician status quo.
He ordered the forgiveness of half a trillion dollars in student debt, about a third of the current total balance, and the Supreme Court told him no. He’s still managed to forgive $138 billion worth of it even against stiff Republican “no we need that money to give to Wall Street criminals pls” resistance.
He introduced a bill to legalize marijuana federally, which the Republicans killed in the senate.
He achieved the lowest unemployment in 20 years after having been handed an economy that was still digging out from the apocalypse that was 2020.
The shitshow that is supporting Israel during its accelerating genocide, I won’t defend all that much. But the overall attempt to paint him as the same as the average Democrat is dead wrong. (And, for what it’s worth, “the DNC as a whole and Hilary Clinton specifically are tone deaf media idiots” I’ll also fully agree with.)
All the folks that like to post memes like this haven’t had much success in trying to say any of the above isn’t true.
yup. wish into one hand, shit into the other and see which fills up first. We’ve got a monumental shit storm coming in november and these dolts want to quibble about results when the alternative is the 2025 project to destroy our country.
I love following you in all these posts. I actually started adding tags to people after I saw your post a few times. The tags really make it more noticeable how small a lot of these communities are when you can point out the same few people making posts and comments. I highly recommend tagging people for anyone who doesn’t already.
Biden campaigned on the notion that ‘nothing fundamentally will change’ - big surprise that the people who think we need fundamental systemic change aren’t happy with what little he’s done to paper over big issues.
Liberals are just not in alignment with leftist goals, i’m not sure why we keep pretending otherwise.
I know whenever a US president tries to legalize marijuana federally and spend a trillion dollars on student loan forgiveness and climate change and more or less doubles the amount of tax Amazon is paying, I’m like “wow, nothing is changing.”
I would love a Bernie Sanders person who would do more. Do you know what Trump might do if he wins the election to Bernie Sanders or an activist organization who’s advocating for even more systemic change?
Why would cannabis rescheduling matter to someone who thinks the climate has already crossed the carbon-feedback tipping-point and we’re a decade away from mass-crop failure?
Why would forgiving a fraction of existing federally-owned student debt matter to someone who believes that capital accumulation is accelerating and locking them into a permanent state of home rental and wage slavery regardless?
If you believe that our current political climate (and the rise of fascism in the US) is a direct result of 200+ years of capital accumulation leading to very real and accelerating economic disenfranchisement of the working class, why would a politician who swears by and protects that system from fundamental change be one you are at all happy with?
‘But if you don’t help us beat this other guy things will only get worse!’ is a pointless plea to those who believe that the system Biden is defending is what is creating the fascist movement to begin with. The people you are trying to reason with are closer to blowing up a pipeline than they are to being convinced that modest incremental change will do anything more than give fascists more time to organize their own movement.
You don’t need to share that perspective to understand why those people might find the accomplishments in your list petty and ineffectual.
Why would cannabis rescheduling matter to someone who thinks the climate has already crossed the carbon-feedback tipping-point and we’re a decade away from mass-crop failure?
Because better outcomes are better than worse ones. Maybe a second term for Biden would enable him to maintain the policies that are planned to remove a billion tons per year of CO2 emissions, maybe even add a little to it, whereas Trump would reverse even those pitifully small gains and actually add to US emissions. Maybe 20 years down the road that little bit is what tips us into a “luckier” (relatively speaking) outcome, avoids a total runaway greenhouse effect that literally kills us all, and we get away with merely mass starvation and the loss of most of the biosphere. But humanity gets to continue after that within the wreckage, having learned an agonizing lesson about the consequences of its actions, instead of being extinguished.
Do you brush your teeth? Why? Why would you need a job, if because with the way the climate is going you may not grow old enough for your money or the state of your teeth to matter at all?
Maybe 20 years down the road that little bit is what tips us into a “luckier” (relatively speaking) outcome
You’re not listening. The people you’re talking to do not believe we have 20 years.
You don’t have to agree with that analysis in order to understand the objections of those who do. Repeatedly berating leftists for critiquing Biden isn’t going to persuade them to change their mind.
So is this, like, a one-way thing? Like I listen to their viewpoints but if I say my viewpoint, then it’s “You’re not listening” and then repetition of the viewpoint?
They’re welcome to their opinion. This is mine, including why I think some particular ones of them are shills, and including that if anyone is concerned with activism outside of the system and real change in the United States they should be breaking their back making sure it’s not Trump in the fall, because unlike Biden he will absolutely destroy their ability to organize and get anything done, maybe until it’s permanently too late to do anything productive for the planet.
You can, of course, think what you like about it. Just stating my take on it and answering your question.
Of course not, I just think that pretending that they share the same interests and concerns as you is naive and willfully ignorant of their viewpoint. They clearly understand that you do not share their interests. Bragging about the marginal improvements to the problematic system they are fighting against is the height of hubris, especially if the aim is to actually change their mind.
“Put your concerns aside so that you can work for change when the stakes are lower” is just asking those people to sacrifice the only political leverage they have so that a politician that is ambivalent about their concerns can win re-election. If you’re uncomfortable with the threat of their dissent then it is having exactly the intended effect and they should absolutely keep doing it.
“Put your concerns aside so that you can work for change when the stakes are lower” is just asking those people to sacrifice the only political leverage they have so that a politician that is ambivalent about their concerns can win re-election.
I think these people who are working for change will be in a better position to do so if there’s an extra billion tons of CO2 per year not getting put into the atmosphere, and if they can protest without worrying if paramilitary forces are going to shoot them with lethal rounds. That means voting for Biden in this election. I’m certainly not telling them to put anything aside while they’re doing that.
“Y’all” is the shills, OP included. I wrote the above in response to some conversation about Biden; at this point I’m using it as a copypasta because I haven’t seen any of the here’s-something-bad-about-Biden-gotta-go-my-planet-needs-me crowd have any real substantive response to any of it and it constantly irritates me that they’re constantly posting “hello fellow kids we all agree Biden sucks for these vaguely-defined reasons” things, and I’m tryin to be a hero by putting it up when I see them do it.
Parts of this meme, I agree with. The main part (“Republicans get everything they want”) is a load of horseshit as it pertains to the current president and the current election.
No, I’m mad because people are spreading transparent bullshit on my social network and not even bothering to pretend that they themselves believe it.
I get it if I’m being hostile and condescending and calling them shills and then, wo ho surprise, they’re not excited to talk with me. Makes perfect sense and I’d probably do the same. But it doesn’t change the fact that they’re saying stuff that’s wrong and then not bothering to address on any substantive level if I or anyone else says “hey Biden actually did on YYYY-MM-DD this thing you said he was deliberately not doing because he hates the voters”; they just fly away like Superman to the next misleading meme. They’ve got a right to do it of course, just like I’ve got a right to call them liars about it and explain why.
Yeah, my fear of this person going through my post history and following me from thread to thread (usual thing I find when people have this kind of energy, plus they seem to be stalking a different user and I just don’t think they have the time) went down and now I’m super duper curious!
Ha. I get where you’re coming from; I do give the whole topic maybe more energy than it deserves. It is an important thing to me though.
And no I don’t hound OP or the other accounts I suspect of being shills. OP in particular posts a pretty nonstop flood of this stuff, and if I see some posting he’s made that irritates me because it seems grossly misleading of the truth, I’ll make a comment on it (and reference my belief that he’s a shill). But it’s not because he was the one that posted it or born out of any kind of vendetta. It’s just that reaction of “wtf, that’s wrong” when a post I disagree with comes into my feed, and a little bit of just academic curiosity about my they-are-shills theory.
nah. if you’re too chickenshit to post your argument inline I’m not gonna go hunting through your comment history. //edit - haha I thought this was @AWistfulNihilist not @mozz
Wholeheartedly agree. At least one of them actually did get removed as misinformation (which, it clearly was; it was particularly blatantly dishonest and OP was making no effort in the comments to argue that it wasn’t.)
In my opinion though it’s actually better for it to be around. I think as long as I or someone wants to take the time for a detailed factual rebuttal, the overall impact on the community is actually a net positive. Debate is a good thing, and the shills aren’t doing a real good job of selling their case; they’re just using a fairly blunt Goebbels-style endless repetition tactic, and doing such a hamfisted and obvious job with it that people seem like they’re mostly seeing through it at this point.
If y’all are going to post an incessant drumbeat of why Biden sucks, I’m just gonna keep pasting a few of the reasons why he doesn’t. It’s not just that it’s not his fault that the Republicans kept him from doing good things (although they did prevent him doing much more than that); even hampered by their obstruction, he still managed to among other things:
The shitshow that is supporting Israel during its accelerating genocide, I won’t defend all that much. But the overall attempt to paint him as the same as the average Democrat is dead wrong. (And, for what it’s worth, “the DNC as a whole and Hilary Clinton specifically are tone deaf media idiots” I’ll also fully agree with.)
All the folks that like to post memes like this haven’t had much success in trying to say any of the above isn’t true.
yup. wish into one hand, shit into the other and see which fills up first. We’ve got a monumental shit storm coming in november and these dolts want to quibble about results when the alternative is the 2025 project to destroy our country.
I love following you in all these posts. I actually started adding tags to people after I saw your post a few times. The tags really make it more noticeable how small a lot of these communities are when you can point out the same few people making posts and comments. I highly recommend tagging people for anyone who doesn’t already.
How do you tag people?
I only use connect so I can’t speak for all apps or the website but I just click someone’s post/comment, hit the 3 dots and add a user note.
Yup, i tag the shills. Helps u take note of whose pushing the agendas the parent comment is talking about.
Biden campaigned on the notion that ‘nothing fundamentally will change’ - big surprise that the people who think we need fundamental systemic change aren’t happy with what little he’s done to paper over big issues.
Liberals are just not in alignment with leftist goals, i’m not sure why we keep pretending otherwise.
I know whenever a US president tries to legalize marijuana federally and spend a trillion dollars on student loan forgiveness and climate change and more or less doubles the amount of tax Amazon is paying, I’m like “wow, nothing is changing.”
I would love a Bernie Sanders person who would do more. Do you know what Trump might do if he wins the election to Bernie Sanders or an activist organization who’s advocating for even more systemic change?
Why would cannabis rescheduling matter to someone who thinks the climate has already crossed the carbon-feedback tipping-point and we’re a decade away from mass-crop failure?
Why would forgiving a fraction of existing federally-owned student debt matter to someone who believes that capital accumulation is accelerating and locking them into a permanent state of home rental and wage slavery regardless?
If you believe that our current political climate (and the rise of fascism in the US) is a direct result of 200+ years of capital accumulation leading to very real and accelerating economic disenfranchisement of the working class, why would a politician who swears by and protects that system from fundamental change be one you are at all happy with?
‘But if you don’t help us beat this other guy things will only get worse!’ is a pointless plea to those who believe that the system Biden is defending is what is creating the fascist movement to begin with. The people you are trying to reason with are closer to blowing up a pipeline than they are to being convinced that modest incremental change will do anything more than give fascists more time to organize their own movement.
You don’t need to share that perspective to understand why those people might find the accomplishments in your list petty and ineffectual.
You’re not wrong and neither is @mozz@mbin.grits.dev.
You can both be right. I’m more in the “we’re all fucked” doomer camp, but I want to see less harm done, even if it is petty and ineffectual.
Because better outcomes are better than worse ones. Maybe a second term for Biden would enable him to maintain the policies that are planned to remove a billion tons per year of CO2 emissions, maybe even add a little to it, whereas Trump would reverse even those pitifully small gains and actually add to US emissions. Maybe 20 years down the road that little bit is what tips us into a “luckier” (relatively speaking) outcome, avoids a total runaway greenhouse effect that literally kills us all, and we get away with merely mass starvation and the loss of most of the biosphere. But humanity gets to continue after that within the wreckage, having learned an agonizing lesson about the consequences of its actions, instead of being extinguished.
Do you brush your teeth? Why? Why would you need a job, if because with the way the climate is going you may not grow old enough for your money or the state of your teeth to matter at all?
You’re not listening. The people you’re talking to do not believe we have 20 years.
You don’t have to agree with that analysis in order to understand the objections of those who do. Repeatedly berating leftists for critiquing Biden isn’t going to persuade them to change their mind.
So is this, like, a one-way thing? Like I listen to their viewpoints but if I say my viewpoint, then it’s “You’re not listening” and then repetition of the viewpoint?
They’re welcome to their opinion. This is mine, including why I think some particular ones of them are shills, and including that if anyone is concerned with activism outside of the system and real change in the United States they should be breaking their back making sure it’s not Trump in the fall, because unlike Biden he will absolutely destroy their ability to organize and get anything done, maybe until it’s permanently too late to do anything productive for the planet.
You can, of course, think what you like about it. Just stating my take on it and answering your question.
My best organizing years were 2016-2017 and 2020.
Of course not, I just think that pretending that they share the same interests and concerns as you is naive and willfully ignorant of their viewpoint. They clearly understand that you do not share their interests. Bragging about the marginal improvements to the problematic system they are fighting against is the height of hubris, especially if the aim is to actually change their mind.
“Put your concerns aside so that you can work for change when the stakes are lower” is just asking those people to sacrifice the only political leverage they have so that a politician that is ambivalent about their concerns can win re-election. If you’re uncomfortable with the threat of their dissent then it is having exactly the intended effect and they should absolutely keep doing it.
I think these people who are working for change will be in a better position to do so if there’s an extra billion tons of CO2 per year not getting put into the atmosphere, and if they can protest without worrying if paramilitary forces are going to shoot them with lethal rounds. That means voting for Biden in this election. I’m certainly not telling them to put anything aside while they’re doing that.
what if i come up with a really whitty nickname like “ivan” or “big baby”? do you think that would make them change their moral approach?
I have no idea how to interpret this comment.
Who is y’all and where is this meme saying Biden sucks? Is this like a copy pasta? Sounds like you agree with the meme.
“Y’all” is the shills, OP included. I wrote the above in response to some conversation about Biden; at this point I’m using it as a copypasta because I haven’t seen any of the here’s-something-bad-about-Biden-gotta-go-my-planet-needs-me crowd have any real substantive response to any of it and it constantly irritates me that they’re constantly posting “hello fellow kids we all agree Biden sucks for these vaguely-defined reasons” things, and I’m tryin to be a hero by putting it up when I see them do it.
Parts of this meme, I agree with. The main part (“Republicans get everything they want”) is a load of horseshit as it pertains to the current president and the current election.
Are you mad cause people won’t get into arguments with you about why they don’t like Biden?
No, I’m mad because people are spreading transparent bullshit on my social network and not even bothering to pretend that they themselves believe it.
I get it if I’m being hostile and condescending and calling them shills and then, wo ho surprise, they’re not excited to talk with me. Makes perfect sense and I’d probably do the same. But it doesn’t change the fact that they’re saying stuff that’s wrong and then not bothering to address on any substantive level if I or anyone else says “hey Biden actually did on YYYY-MM-DD this thing you said he was deliberately not doing because he hates the voters”; they just fly away like Superman to the next misleading meme. They’ve got a right to do it of course, just like I’ve got a right to call them liars about it and explain why.
Honestly you seem a little angry and intimidating, I wouldn’t engage with you much either.
I tried faking being nice when I’m irritated about something, and the result is usually just even more off putting.
That’s legit hilarious and relatable and makes me feel better about you!
Yet you keep engaging. Curious.
Yeah, my fear of this person going through my post history and following me from thread to thread (usual thing I find when people have this kind of energy, plus they seem to be stalking a different user and I just don’t think they have the time) went down and now I’m super duper curious!
Ha. I get where you’re coming from; I do give the whole topic maybe more energy than it deserves. It is an important thing to me though.
And no I don’t hound OP or the other accounts I suspect of being shills. OP in particular posts a pretty nonstop flood of this stuff, and if I see some posting he’s made that irritates me because it seems grossly misleading of the truth, I’ll make a comment on it (and reference my belief that he’s a shill). But it’s not because he was the one that posted it or born out of any kind of vendetta. It’s just that reaction of “wtf, that’s wrong” when a post I disagree with comes into my feed, and a little bit of just academic curiosity about my they-are-shills theory.
And what are you doing? Engaging repeatedly without shit to offer as a premise, just another shit talker.
Feel free to respond to my list of facts
nah. if you’re too chickenshit to post your argument inline I’m not gonna go hunting through your comment history. //edit - haha I thought this was @AWistfulNihilist not @mozz
I was wondering why they were coming in so hot on a meme the agree with, apparently it’s a multi thread fight.
spam. this is spam.
Wholeheartedly agree. At least one of them actually did get removed as misinformation (which, it clearly was; it was particularly blatantly dishonest and OP was making no effort in the comments to argue that it wasn’t.)
In my opinion though it’s actually better for it to be around. I think as long as I or someone wants to take the time for a detailed factual rebuttal, the overall impact on the community is actually a net positive. Debate is a good thing, and the shills aren’t doing a real good job of selling their case; they’re just using a fairly blunt Goebbels-style endless repetition tactic, and doing such a hamfisted and obvious job with it that people seem like they’re mostly seeing through it at this point.
your comment is the spam. the meme is legit.
🙂